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Ludger Borger
New member
Username: Ludger

Post Number: 5
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Wednesday, October 17, 2007 - 10:47 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Does any one know what the requirements are for obtaining permanent residency in Argentina?
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1342
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Wednesday, October 17, 2007 - 7:28 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Ludger, this has been discussed in the past. Some members offered some advice here and here
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peter jameson
New member
Username: Pcj

Post Number: 1
Registered: 8-2007
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 4:14 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hello,
My wife and I are thinking of moving to Argentina from Canada. My wife is a native Argentinian and I am Canadian Born.
I would be interested in hearing from expats from Canada / US / Europe regarding their contentment and or regrets with regard to living in Argentina. Quite frankly, every Argentinian-Canadian I speak to (time in canada ranges between 5 and 20 years) seems to think we are crazy for even considering the move.
While my wife is looking forward to being close to her family, all the negativity from expat Argentines is getting me kind of spooked.
Thanks for your help.
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WTMendoza.com
Member
Username: Welcometomendoza

Post Number: 56
Registered: 7-2007


Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 4:33 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Peter, we got the same treatment from our northern hemisphere friends. You will find tha most people that make those comments have never been here.

It is true that is a bit of a step backwards when it comes to effiency and infrastructure, but if you open your mind, breathe deep, and enjoy the culture, it is fantastic. It's like the twilight zone here. One foot in the first world, one foot in the third world, one arm in the 50's and one arm in the 80's...with many fingers in the 21st century. I kind of hope it doesn't move along to fast....good luck!
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James Guglielmino
New member
Username: Jgug1

Post Number: 18
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 4:45 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I would be interested in knowing why these Canadians feel that way.
Also, WTMendoza's post is very clever and very well put.
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peter jameson
New member
Username: Pcj

Post Number: 2
Registered: 8-2007
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 5:57 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi...James...just to clarify...the people I refer to are native Argentinians who have recently immigrated to Canada, mostly from BS AS and Mendoza...Not native Canadians per se.
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WTMendoza.com
Member
Username: Welcometomendoza

Post Number: 57
Registered: 7-2007


Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 8:47 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks James -
Peter - ah yes I missed that ..it is so funny - 97%+ of Argentine expats I meet over the years exlaim the "night and day" differences (somewhat exxagerated of course) between the country infrastructure, and some turtle slow and/or absurd processes found here, and surely the more natural freedmom and advancement they probably feel becuase of it. We got flack from them too. These are usully bolder folks, like us expats in general, that must surely feel more freedom and opportunity from their move.
I gotta tell ya though, 80% of these Argie epxtas I meet seem to long for their original culture and traditions and often the places they moved from (all of us right?) , many Argies made fun of us (it's fun to make fun of Argentina!) for moving here but some openly admitted they were jealous. cheers
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peter jameson
New member
Username: Pcj

Post Number: 3
Registered: 8-2007
Posted on Saturday, November 17, 2007 - 8:41 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks for taking the time to write WTM, Your post was very helpful.
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1378
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 10:19 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Peter, as one that has moved away I understand the comments you have received from other expats. But then, those comments should be put into perspective. Very likely, some if not all these expats were just fed up with daily troubles... or couldn't make ends meet... or deeply felt lack of opportunity and for sure went through some event that became the turning point. In my case, it was the military revolt in Dec. 1990 together with the latest hyperinflation during Alfonsin's time which led to the collapse of his government. I took a plane on Jan. 1991 with the little funds I could gather.

If you can put these comments into the right perspective they should not influence your decisions to move. And although WTM comments about the twilight zone are funny -in a good way-, I think they are also very precise. If you don't have to go through the daily grind and if you don't carry argentine's heavy history (like myself) you will have nothing but a great time. Finally, don't forget we, argentines, are correctly portrayed in tango songs... which speak of gloom most of the time. If you meet locals who also speak the blue, stop and watch all restaurants full every night and then you will know the truth. Ask your wife about a famous phrase in one of the most famous tangos 'el que no llora no mama' which is at the center of our idiosincracy.
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Gayle
Junior Member
Username: Flaka

Post Number: 40
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 11:00 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Roberto,

I do agree with what you stated about expats comments. My husband's family is Argentine and he has an Argentine passport, has lived there, so he knows the country and its history quite well. We loved our experience there and hope to return (fingers crossed) next year.

By the way my husband promised to download the picture he took at La Tranquera in October with some of the members at our get together.
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Keith Mangan
New member
Username: Kreation

Post Number: 8
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 11:47 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Peter;

Just said I'd post my two-cents.

"It is true that is a bit of a step backwards when it comes to efficiency and infrastructure, but if you open your mind, breathe deep, and enjoy the culture, it is fantastic. It's like the twilight zone here. One foot in the first world, one foot in the third world, one arm in the 50's and one arm in the 80's...with many fingers in the 21st century. "

These comments from WTM are spot on.I can only speak for BA as that is all I know.I'm Irish and came down here 8 months ago full time after multiple 3-4 month visits.
Things happen much slower here;everything happens much slower; its a small bit of a time warp in certain cases.My personal pet hate is when you are trying to buy things; lines in supermarkets take an eternity ; Argentines are the most patient people I have ever met; but on the upside small local shops can take as long as you want-fast or slow- chat or no-chat; depends what your in the mood for;reminds me of classic 50's mom-n -pop movies where you get a chat as well as your commodities.
In most cafes and restaurants expect to wait for your bill; there is virtually no chance of a rush-in rush-out bite to eat; if your paying it means your staying; something that took a lot of getting used to for me; but to be honest something I have adapted to and actually quite like.
I haven't been to Canada so I really cant compare as to your system; but it is definitely not like the north American dining experience.Orders are delivered casually and in their own time; as are drinks; if you want it you most likely will have to wait..:-)
A lot of systems are old and archaic here; causing much hassle for the locals ; but they adapt and you will too.I often find myself grinning at a system that causes much grief for the average Argentine and myself; come up with a solution in my head; and then find when said to my wife (shes Argentine) I find they know;the government knows; the companies know; but no-one is willing/able to do anything about it.There is mindsets here that don't want to be changed .Its not a bad thing ;its just inefficient in some cases.

Red-tape abounds ; but go about it the right way and it can be done.You just have to follow the rules and regulations laid down when the country had a population of 6 people and it was a system that functioned perfectly:-).It functions but slowly...ohh so slowly:-).It just needs an upgrade ; Argentine System Version 2.0 or Vista.


I love the culture and the people down here; but there can be a lot of mistrust between locals; the solution? a quick Hola and a smile can break-through any barriers; and once you do you meet a race full of joy and glee no matter what the situation; a true lionhearted nation.

In short everything takes longer here;personal and work-wise;but if you have the patience to sit back and take it all in ;you will discover a city and a people that are worth every second (or hour!! ) of the wait.

Keith}}
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Christopher Henson
New member
Username: Sandiegochris

Post Number: 9
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 12:12 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Well spoken, well said, Keith......Ditto.
You hit the nail on the head with your description of Argentina from a foreigner's perspective.
Thanks for the upbeat response to what can be a daunting process for most.

Chris Henson
www.refresh-med.com



(Message edited by admin on November 19, 2007)
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1380
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 1:57 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

> In short everything takes longer here

Not too bad if you are in the middle of great 'asado'.

Gayle, whenever your husband is ready for the pics send them over.

Chris, I will have to delink your sig as we prefer not to do that here. It's in your profile, anyway.

Everyone, great comments!
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Arial
Intermediate Member
Username: Arial

Post Number: 109
Registered: 10-2006


Posted on Friday, November 23, 2007 - 1:33 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

About having to wait for your check in a restaurant. I think it is considered rude to bring your check before you ask for it. sort of like suggesting to a guest that they should leave is what I decided. I have never received a check in Argentina without asking. And then, because of the time it took, if I know the restaurant and the prices, I have just left the money on the table. If I catch their eye as I leave, they will wave. And still no check.

But . . . I like it. Arial
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Gayle
Junior Member
Username: Flaka

Post Number: 42
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Friday, November 23, 2007 - 10:22 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I agree with Arial. I hate that in the US they seem to always ask "is everything alright" when you have food in your mouth and then asking do you want the check and do you need change. I certainly miss this about Argentina and also Europe. I think it is so rude and, obviously, the majority of wait staff in the U.S. are not trained properly.
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Arial
Intermediate Member
Username: Arial

Post Number: 110
Registered: 10-2006


Posted on Friday, November 23, 2007 - 12:13 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I don't mind that they do that in the US. It is just that I had to get used to Argentina and understand why the check was so slow in coming. Or never came at all! Once I did, it was fine. Some of you Argentine nationals please feel free to correct me, but it is also proper to say goodbye and thank the owner of the restaurant and/or the cook (I am not sure actually) as you leave. Again, sort of like you were their guest. Very gracious! That's what I like about you Argentines! One thing anyway. There are others.

In the US we are usually in such a hurry that I think the wait staff in the US are just accommodating our lifestyle.
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1390
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Wednesday, November 28, 2007 - 5:33 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

> In the US we are usually in such a hurry.

My US ex-wife used to tell me that these differences -which she also noticed when in Argentina- were related to deep cultural issues. I remember a funny comment she once made about the pilgrim furniture being made in such a way that would not allow any kind of enjoyment/pleasure. In Argentina, it is all about 'hanging out' and feeling the moment. But there is negative side to it, of course. As spaniards founded the colonies to steal the riches and not to create a productive society based on hard work. So in one side of the planet there may be humans that have barely learned how to relax while on the other side we see humans that have barely learned how live together and create an efficient, productive society.

When you get tired of any one side, all it takes is an overnight flight.
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Francisco
New member
Username: Pacopancho

Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2008
Posted on Monday, May 05, 2008 - 12:20 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

i have two friends... one from the U.S.A. and one from Germany, who are interested in staying with me in Argentina for a few years. Will this be possible for them? Is there any way they can get a temporary residence visa without being officially employed? If they just get the three month tourist visa, how many times can they renew it?
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1655
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Monday, May 05, 2008 - 9:30 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Fransisco, the most common procedure for those who want an extended stay but prefer avoiding all the hassle of becoming residents is to cross the border for a day or so and renew the tourist visa upon return. It has been discussed here by many expats/members who either crossed into Brazil or Uruguay and came back. If I remember correctly, it has been said there are no limits as to how many times a foreigner can do this.
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Francisco
New member
Username: Pacopancho

Post Number: 6
Registered: 5-2008
Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 4:36 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

thanks, roberto, for that information. That sure seems an easy way to stay on longish term. It would be good to hear from anyone who has actually EXPERIENCED doing this in practice (ie. crossing the boarder and then coming back, and how many times they were able to do it). I am assuming that one would have to pay a fee every time they cross. Is that right? Does anyone know how much the fee would be? Also, say you are going to Brazil and back... would you have to pay for a visa to get INTO Brazil, as well as one to come back into Argentina?

Thanks for any info. By the way, this is a great site, and I hope to be on it for quite some time.
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Simon Fawkes
Member
Username: Expatba

Post Number: 65
Registered: 1-2007


Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 5:00 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Francisco

It depends on your nationality whether you have to pay for a visa. I believe US citizens have to pay US$50 to enter Brazil, whereas British citizens pay nothing.

I suggest you check the Embassy's website and check for your nationality. Similar provisions may apply going to Uruguay or Chile.

Simon Fawkes
Author, The Complete Guide To Real Estate Investment in Argentina, ISBN 1430303980, http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1430303980
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Arial
Intermediate Member
Username: Arial

Post Number: 207
Registered: 10-2006


Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 6:10 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

As far as I know, Argentina does not charge anyone for crossing their border by bus. At least they don't charge U.S. Citizens no matter how many times you enter and exit.

When I was crossing the border to renew my visa, there was no charge to Chile by bus. Chile does charge U. S. citizens $100 if we fly in to a Chile airport. There was no charge to or from Uruguay by boat or bus. It is just a normal border crossing.

The last information I have is that U.S. citizens are charged $200 to enter Brazil in any fashion. However, Simon's info may be correct.

When I lived in Bariloche, I asked at Imigraciones whether I might have a problem some time merely crossing the border every 90 days and they said they didn't care how many times I crossed. However, things have a way of changing in Argentina and that was three years ago.

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