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Adam Walker
New member
Username: Adam_walker

Post Number: 1
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Saturday, April 28, 2007 - 2:02 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hello to everyone! I was hoping you could help advise me - I am trying to move to Argentina (from the UK), and I have been given a mxed message regarding Visa's.

I plan on heading to Argentina on a tourist visa - firstly, can i get a tourit visa if I don't have a return ticket?

I ask this as my plan is to search for work in this 3 months. I have a couple of companies interested in speaking to me when I arrive. I realise if this works out they will need to sponsor my Visa. I have been in touch with a firm that puts this though for you (costing around 1000 pounds), they said that I would need to process everything from my own country - I was therefore going to return to the UK to do this, however my girlfriend spoke directly to the immigration department there in BA and they said that I can do this from here - they also said I could do it myself, and it would only cost a couple of hundred dollars...

Does anyone know which is correct? Or anywhere I can find the right info out?

Adam
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1084
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Saturday, April 28, 2007 - 6:47 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Difficult to advise. But here is one caveat: in Argentina you will receive different information/opinions/advice according to whom you talk and when so you have to take everything with a grain of salt. There is a prior thread where members have discussed this partially. You can always pm them to know more about it.

I think tourist visas and airplane tickets are independent processes and at the consulate they will not ask you about your travel plan.
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movingtoargentina.typepad.com
Member
Username: Sapphos

Post Number: 83
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Saturday, April 28, 2007 - 11:01 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Adam, for a U.K. resident you get your tourist visa as you enter the country - they will not ask you about your return ticket, however, some airlines will force you into taking a return ticket although some of the check in people don't bother you so it's a hit or miss proposition. You can always say that Argentina is not your final destinatoin and you will be traveling on land for some time afterwards.

As far as your visa, Roberto is correct, you can get a different answer from every person you speak to. One of the things I would recommend is visiting the Argentine consulate in the U.K. Also, I don't know which firm you are talking about, but it's buyer beware. However, I wouldn't suggest you do it yourself. If the company that wants to hire you is a reputable company then they should be paying for your visa. Don't get caught up with one of those companies who say they'll hire you but you have to pay for your own visa...no no no...bad news.
Also, while it's possible to do things from inside of Argentina you will have a more difficult time because you'll need documents to be apostilled etc so it's much easier when you're in your home country and need to track down documents.

hope this helps a bit

Laura
Ebook Moving to Argentina
http://movingtoargentina.typepad.com/ebook
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Benco
New member
Username: Benco

Post Number: 4
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Sunday, April 29, 2007 - 7:29 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I'm not an immigration lawyer, but here is what I heard.

In any case you will need a birth certificate with apostille and a recent police record with apostille. At least you should get these documents from your local authorities before heading to Argentina.

When you get your visa on the basis of a work contract, it means that it will be difficult to change employers in the future - your visa is tied to the specific contract. Better check if you qualify for other types of visa, for example the rentista visa. There is no concept of 'work permit' here, anyone with temporary residence (not the transitory tourist card) can work legally and enter the job market on an equal footing with the locals.

It is a tedious process to get a temporary visa, and a company will only do it for you if you have very special skills and they really need you. Otherwise they will simply prefer to hire a local. Make sure that you understand the general working conditions in Argentina - you should expect to earn about 20 to 30 percent of what you used to earn in Europe. If you have the option, it is much better to get a job in an international organization in Europe that sends you to Argentina as an expat.

Good luck.
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Adam Walker
New member
Username: Adam_walker

Post Number: 2
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Sunday, April 29, 2007 - 9:50 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

This is very helpful information, thanks! I really appreciate you taking the time to reply.

Another question for you all - lets say hypothetically, my current employer were considering to let me work remotely for them, as I had said I want time out but they want to keep me as an employee. This means they would continue to pay me in pounds, (a daily rate, I could do 2-3 days a week) and I'd continue paying UK tax etc. - how would anyone know the work I am performing is from my living room in England or an apartment in Argentina?! I don't think my boss would care as we get on well, so i could do it in Argentina without a work permit - or am I being niaeve?
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movingtoargentina.typepad.com
Member
Username: Sapphos

Post Number: 84
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Sunday, April 29, 2007 - 10:22 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

on that same note as Benco was saying, another great route is just to enter on a tourist visa and stay that way for awhile, you can always "telecommute" and the company can pay your bank account in the UK. or you can work as a freelancer in general.
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Bill Howard
New member
Username: Veritas01

Post Number: 25
Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Sunday, April 29, 2007 - 1:54 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I have been an IT Manager for over 35 years. Companies that truly embrace telecommuting really don't care where you are. However, most companies like to keep some physical connection. That might involve having you come to the office now and then for a meeting or being able to be contacted by phone or FedEx (both of those latter issues would give you away.) It also comes down to your work. How good is it. How irreplaceable is your contribution. How much do you get paid. That type of thing. But technically sure it doesn't make a bit of difference. A friend of mine retired a couple of years ago and visited Argentina with me. He was working for his former employer as a programmer from home. He was thinking about spending the summer in Argentina and telecomuting but the meetings killed it. He could swing the conference calls but not the face to face meetings obviously. Of course it comes down to productivity. If you create a good product cheap then a good boss will not care. Not sure if there are legal ramifications or tax issues for the employer. I cant think why there would be. But that is clearly the way to go. Earn a UK or US salary...even a modest one and live well in Argentina until the economy (inflation) erodes the difference or the boom implodes and you are faced with a recession. You would have to be careful about Argentine income tax perhaps. And you would need a 100% solid high speed web connection. But it is the ideal situation if you can pull it off. Remember however you are competiting with Indian companies for outsourced IT talent. So you must sell yourself personally and again that often means being available face to face. Hope this made sense.
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Roberto
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1085
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Sunday, April 29, 2007 - 4:45 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

> or am I being naive?

No you are not.

But following Bill's statement of 'it comes down to productivity' make sure you have done some homework in regards to working online from Argentina. You don't want to find out that upstream speeds are absolutely horrible making some tasks a complete headache. I rely on excellent broadband and for the last 6 years I only had painful experiences keeping up with work while in BA. One time, I even went out of my way to acquire a fiber connection that I thought would end my misery. I was wrong. And then, there are the unusual circumstances you may come across from time to time... like the shutdown of international connections the days Bush visited the country last year (was it Mar del Plata?). Many may say it is fine, but if you plan to *work* 2 or 3 days a week for 8 or 10 hours then you are advised to look into this. Do you need industrial strength upstream or just average downstream of 1.5 meg?
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Benco
New member
Username: Benco

Post Number: 5
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Monday, April 30, 2007 - 3:33 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

In addition to Robertos warning on potential technical problems, please take into account that you might also run into all sorts of trouble with insurances. Working on a tourist visa is not legal, and although I dont't think immigration or tax authorities will find out, insurances are problematic.

For example, when you stay for longer periods (which is easily possible on tourist cards), you will need some health care solution. Imagine you have a severe car accident and need intensive care in a hospital - who is going to pay the huge bill?

My bet is that your health insurance back in the UK won't pay, and any additional travel insurance you might have won't pay either when they find out that you were doing business. And they can find that out easily by contacting your employer. Although I am not completely sure, I also assume that any special insurance packages for expats will require that you are a legal resident.

You might still decide to take the risk, just make sure that you are fully aware of these potential problems.
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Steven Leslie
New member
Username: Sleslie23

Post Number: 8
Registered: 1-2007
Posted on Monday, April 30, 2007 - 9:34 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Regarding telecommuting from one country while getting paid from another, my experience has been that it depends on how "cool" your HR and payroll department are.

If they find out, they will generally not allow it. Usually, you are allowed to work 90 days or less in another country without tax liability. Beyond that, you are required to have a work permit and pay taxes in the country where you live. Tax laws are generally based on physical presence not on where you are paid from. At least that is the case with the countries I have dealt with (France, Spain, Argentina, and the US).

I worked all of 2006 from Paris and everything was perfect. My manager was happy, I was happy. As long as no one knew, there were no problems. When HR found out they were very unhappy. Fortunately, THEY ended up paying the tax difference but they insisted that I file a French tax return.

I do understand why, however. Although the only way it would ever be a problem is if THEY said something, there is potentially a lot of liability for any company that is paying employees who are living in another country.

Now I am being officially transferred to BsAs, so life is not so bad.
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Arial
Member
Username: Arial

Post Number: 75
Registered: 10-2006


Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 10:56 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Regarding insurance, it is possible there is an agreement between the UK and Argentina for the socialized medical coverage of the UK to cover emergency treatment in Argentina. Ten years ago that was the case between the UK and Israel. My roommate in Israel, a nurse from England, got some much needed surgery done in Israel on that agreement. A doctor suggested it, declared her case an "emergency," and the UK paid. Perhaps there is such an agreement with Argentina. Arial
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Bill Howard
Junior Member
Username: Veritas01

Post Number: 26
Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 11:37 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I have looked at Argentina from the US perspective. I know that Medicare/Medicaid is not valid outside of the United States. I also know that some foreign insurance (Blue Cross and Blue Shield) in the US for example is valid but it will only reimburse you for costs you pay out of pocket. So I would go to any private hospital in Argentina, pay the tab, and file a claim with the US company accompanied by my medical records for the treatment (translated into English). Not a bad system unless the treatment is major and requires a big outlay of money upfront. Of course Argentina has public hospitals that I understand will treat anyone regardless of status or nationality free of charge. However, while I have been told the doctors can be good at public hospitals the facilties are poor and the waits can be intolerable. The final and probably best choice is to purchase private insurance which looks like it is hospital based. You probably need a DNI to purchase it but since it is private I would not give up on the notion that one of the insurers in BA might insure a foreigner as long as they pay the premium on time. There is also travelers insurance that covers you when you are abroad but it is so expensive it is absurd and the coverage periods are designed for travelers not semi-permanent residents.

I plan to move to Argentina soon. Being married to an Argentine helps. I can get a permanent visa through marriage. I will buy private insurance but I am also planning on returning to the US every year for a few months and in that period I will see all my doctors and dentists and the like. That is the plan anyway. Good luck.
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Adam Walker
New member
Username: Adam_walker

Post Number: 3
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 5:13 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Again, thanks for all of your comments - medical cover was certainly one I was wondering about - it's good to know there are some options out there.

It sounds like the telecommuting is a good idea if my firm will play ball - I think the only reason they will go for it is if I agree to come back to London and work for them in 6-12 months time - I'd prefer being there for at least 1-2 years, but this could be a good option while I look for work with a BA based firm. I am a recruiter for a global investment bank, I understand there are some good opportunities for recruitment people over in BA, and thankfully I have a great track record, so maybe I'll be lucky and get a job with a firm there.

Thanks again, I hope I can repay you with advice of my own at some point.

Adam
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movingtoargentina.typepad.com
Member
Username: Sapphos

Post Number: 85
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 11:51 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Medical coverage is easy to get and very affordable. You have a variety of choices from Swiss Medical, Medicus, Osde among a few. You do not need to have a DNI to get health insurance. For medicus all we needed were our passports and an address (you can use a friends if you need to). We got full coverage including trip insurance and our insurance covered our daughters birth by csection including all the tests that I couldn't have gotten covered in the U.S. (all included in my monthly premiums).

If you want to find out abot health insurance and want to speak to someone who speaks english then I can recommend someone at Medicus in the suburbs. She'll even come to your house!

feel free to pm me if you want her information.

Laura
Ebook Moving to Argentina
http://movingtoargentina.typepad.com/ebook
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Bill Howard
Junior Member
Username: Veritas01

Post Number: 27
Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 8:33 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks Laura for the update. Could you tell us what a typical monthly premium would run for two adults and a child? Does it increase annually based on your usage of services or is it fixed? Are there any services that are specifically excluded that we would feel should be covered and the opposite do they cover things that normally would not be covered in the US...you mentioned some tests? What type of prescription coverage is included if any? Is there dental insurance available? When you travel and need the insurance will the away from home hospital/clinic accept the insurance and bill your carrier or is it a pay/reimburse arrangement? Can you choose to see any doctor of your chosing or are you restricted to a list of approved providers? Is it an HMO arrangement with a primary care doc who has to refer? Thanks for your help.
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Adam Walker
New member
Username: Adam_walker

Post Number: 4
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 3:20 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi - you have all given some excellent advice on my situation regarding "telecommuting", thanks! Steve, you mentioned that generally one can work abroad for 90 days or less to avoid tax liabilities - is there anywhere I can check this (for the UK)?

Basically my boss has said she'd be happy to not notify HR for a short period, but only for a couple of months.. she's want to do it all above board if it were for as long as 3-6 months. If I can show her that we could do it all "above board" for 2-3 months, it would certainly be a start for me. I am not sure how I could get a Visa for Argentina with my current firm, because we don't have an office or current business affairs over there, so I assume it will be impossible?? But 2-3 months on English wages will give me plenty in the kitty and more time to find a firm in Argentina to employ me!
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movingtoargentina.typepad.com
Member
Username: Sapphos

Post Number: 87
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Monday, May 07, 2007 - 3:55 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hi, sorry for the delay in responding...a four and half month old baby keeps me busy! I'll give you info based on my experiences:
1) typical monthly premium would run for two adults and a child? Medicus fee for the three of us is now 660 pesos (the new increase is shown there)
2)Does it increase annually based on your usage of services or is it fixed?
Fixed except like this year the govern. approved a price hike across the board at all insurance companies
3) Are there any services that are specifically excluded that we would feel should be covered and the opposite do they cover things that normally would not be covered in the US.
If you have a major issue they can exclude it, other than that it is excellent coverage and less hassle than in the U.S. If a doc recommends a test or medicines there is very little flack. I opted to have pricy genetic testing due to my age and being pregnant and they covered every penny.
4) What type of prescription coverage is included if any? Depends upon your plan but usually you pay a small copayment out of pocket.
5) Is there dental insurance available? You can pay for optional dental insurance - at least my experience at medicus
6) When you travel and need the insurance will the away from home hospital/clinic accept the insurance and bill your carrier or is it a pay/reimburse arrangement?
We opted for Medicus travel insurance. they are also affiliated with Duke University in the States.
7) Can you choose to see any doctor of your chosing or are you restricted to a list of approved providers?
again depends upon the plan you take. we have the second best plan and have full choice except we can't choose the "head" of the dept but can get him anyway.
8) Is it an HMO arrangement with a primary care doc who has to refer?
If you need to see a regular doc you go, if you need special test the doc will send you.

Does this help?

Laura
Ebook Moving to Argentina
http://movingtoargentina.typepad.com/ebook}}

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